Seth Tupper/South Dakota Searchlight
It may seem illogical for John Thune to run for Senate Republican leader after he was booed by Republicans in his own state, but as Thune says, “these aren’t normal times.”
The booing happened in September. Former President Donald Trump headlined a South Dakota Republican Party fundraiser in a Rapid City arena packed with 7,000 people. Thune did not attend.
When Thune’s picture appeared on a video board, many in the crowd voiced their disapproval. He heard about it later from members of his Rapid City field office.
“They said, ‘There were a lot of people from other states. That wasn’t all South Dakotans,’” Thune recalled, laughing at the attempt to spare his ego. “Nevertheless, that’s a lot of Republicans booing.”
Thune eventually endorsed Trump, but not until last month, after it was clear the former president would once again be the party’s nominee. The endorsement came three days before Kentucky Sen. Mitch McConnell announced his plan to relinquish the title of Senate minority leader.
McConnell will step down in November, when Senate Republicans will elect his successor. Thune is currently the minority whip, which is the No. 2 Republican Senate position. He and the former whip, John Cornyn of Texas, are the leading candidates to succeed McConnell.
It’s a full circle moment for Thune. He won his Senate seat by beating then-Minority Leader Tom Daschle, a Democrat, in 2004.
Now 63 years old and serving his fourth Senate term after three House terms, Thune spoke recently with South Dakota Searchlight about his ambition to succeed McConnell, his thoughts on Trump, and more. Following are Searchlight’s questions and Thune’s answers, edited for length and clarity.
The last time you were up for reelection, you thought about not running. How do you go from that to seeking a leadership role that you might hold until you’re 82 years old, if you follow McConnell’s lead?
Well, I don’t expect to serve that long. I think Senator McConnell was more the exception than the rule in terms of his longevity, and he obviously got a lot done and leaves big shoes to fill.
But, honestly, as I thought about running for reelection, one of the things that kind of motivated me to do it was the idea that this possibility might come along.
What’s in it for South Dakota if you get the leadership job?
Everybody says, “You ran against Daschle and you made the argument that his leadership position was hurting the state.” And that was because at that time, the national party, the Democrat Party, was moving way left of where South Dakota was, and in many ways his leadership role got him significantly out of sync with people in South Dakota.
I think the majority of South Dakotans’ views on the big issues of the day sync up nicely with the Republican Party, and so I think it’s a chance to put South Dakota’s agenda on the national agenda and do things that are good for our state, and make sure that we have a voice in the major decisions that are made.
When was the last time you saw Tom Daschle?
I haven’t seen Tom in a good long time. I’m trying to remember when the last time would have been. Sometimes there are events in South Dakota where we may be at the same place, or even for that matter out here in Washington, but I typically haven’t had a chance to interact with him.
On the rare occasions when you have interacted, what’s that been like?
Well, as they say, time heals, right?
Does it really? That seems hard to believe, given how bitterly fought that race was.
I think the more time that passes, the less hard those memories are for people. But at one point we were obviously political adversaries. When you’re in politics, you take positions and have to articulate your views in a way that helps your team succeed.
He’s got the luxury now of having been out of politics for some time, and I think that gives you a different perspective. I was out of politics for a while after my first Senate race, too [a loss to then-Sen. Tim Johnson, a Democrat, in 2002]. But eventually you move on, and I sort of feel like that’s been true. I think that both of us realize that this, in a way, is a business, and when you’re in that business, there’s a certain set of rules you play by, but you’re still humans and still care about a lot of the same things, while you have different views on the issues. So I try and take that broader perspective, and I hope he does, too.
Twenty years ago you were a Republican hero for beating Daschle. Then, last year at a South Dakota rally for Trump that you did not attend, you were booed by an arena full of people. How do you process that?
The one thing that I keep in perspective is that I certainly haven’t changed my views. I have the same conservative, core values that I’ve had my entire time in public life and prior to it. I think that these days, politics sometimes revolves around personalities more so than it does the issues. But if you look at the core values — the things that I ran on and ran for — that’s still the same person I am. But I would say that obviously the party, in many ways, is a different party than it was back then.
What’s your place in today’s Republican Party?
Just bringing right-of-center, conservative, common sense to the big issues of the day, whether it’s how we deal with the border, how we deal with the economy, some of the cultural issues. I’m still about limited government, personal freedom coupled with individual responsibility, economic freedom, free markets, free enterprise, strong national defense. Those are the core Republican values that I hold dear and that I want to be able to advocate here in Washington.
Gov. Kristi Noem’s forthcoming book is titled “No Going Back.” The description from the publisher says she “explains how the country is not going back to the Republican Party of the 2000s. And that’s a good thing.” So it sounds like she’s saying the party should move on from people like you. How do you respond to that?
Things have changed. We’re more animated these days by the personality of Donald Trump, and that’s the reality we live with and deal with if you want to be involved in public life. That’s kind of where our voters are, and you have to listen to your voters.
But I also think there are some of these principles that to me are transcendent. And I think if you present your views and articulate the things you believe in, I still believe that you can do that with the strength of your convictions, and knowing that many times you’re going to disagree and disagree strongly with people on the other side of the aisle or the other side of the issue, but you can still do it in a way that is respectful and hopefully appeals to people’s hopes and aspirations rather than preying on their fears.
I’m guessing you probably know President Biden fairly well from his time in the Senate, and I wonder, would it be easier for you to work with him than Trump, at least on a personal level?
Everybody brings their own personality to this, but I would much rather have a President Trump — who I’m going to agree with on the issues probably 95% of the time, although there’ll be some differences — than a President Biden, whose positions on the issues and the direction he’s leading the country is very contrary to where I believe we ought to be headed.
I’ve conveyed that in conversations with former President Trump that if he’s successful — and I think he very well could be — and if we get the majority back in the Senate and I have a leadership role there, we want to hit the ground running and get to work for the American people.
And I think that if you come into this and you’re motivated by that more than anything else, you can put aside some of whatever the personality differences are that you have, and try to focus on the greater good.
Will Trump influence the leader race?
I don’t know the answer to that. Right now we have 49 Republican senators — hopefully after the election it’ll be a slightly higher number — and those are the people that ultimately are going to vote. It’s a secret ballot election. The former president’s views and influence are certainly felt here in the Senate like they are everywhere else. But at the end of the day, I think this is going to be about relationships and what people want to see in the future leader for the Senate.
Obviously, they’re going to want somebody who can work with the president, and I’ve had that conversation with a number of my colleagues and conveyed that directly to the former president that I believe that if he’s the next president, we want to do everything we can to make him successful on behalf of the American people.
Earlier you mentioned being out of politics after you lost a race in 2002. That could’ve been the end of your political career. What’s it been like to go from that to running for Republican Senate leader?
Sometimes there are things you can control in your life and things you can control in politics, and sometimes there are things you can’t. And I’ve been blessed to be on both sides — on the short side of an election from which I learned lessons, and on the winning side. I’m grateful to the good Lord for the lessons you learn in the good times and the bad times, and certainly I’d much rather win than lose. It was more fun in ’04 than it was in ’02, let’s put it that way.
But you learn lessons either way, and I think having lost an election, there’s a certain humility that comes with that. You’re very humbled by that, and I think that helped shape the way I approach work and life more generally, that you’re grateful for the opportunities but realize that they’re all temporary, and you want to make the most of what you’ve been given in the amount of time we have here.